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Notapix

Player

Reputation: +17

Registered: 2017-09-13

Posts: 27

Carrier sinking / respawning on Midway

Hello there,

we had some unpleasant words this morning on Midway, due to the Japanese carrier being sunk by Allies (me, in the Prince of Wales, plus planes and a destroyer). As the Japanese team weren't controlling any flag, they were quite unhappy. It took ages for one to get the sub and sink me. Teams were even in numbers… Maybe not in quality, though.

I've seen that problem arise many times on that map: someone drives the battleship to the opposite side, and as the carrier there is quite fragile and respawns fast, it's repeatedly sinking.

Usually that's not too much of a problem, since there may be planes or other ships around to sink the battleship (a couple torpedoes and it's saying hello to the little fishes). Even if the sub's elsewhere, "victims" have other solutions, lke spawning on the lower deck and escape in a landing craft, which is difficult to sink for a battleship. Trying to take off when the battleship reloads is possible too, as is shooting the battleship with the AA guns (although it works better on destroyers, and takes time anyway). But apparently not everyone can think of that.

Would be possible to decrease the spawn times of the other ships? Maybe depending on the number of flags controlled, if that's possible: the less flags you have, the fastest they respawn. I've got no flags, you sink  my carrier: blam, eat the whole armada respawning in seconds!

Or to give the carrier a couple of different spawn points, so that if it's sunk once it respawns someplace else? You sink it in B4, it respawns in A1 so you can't just resink it.

Making it plain unsinkable wouldn't be fun, but making it harder to sink would be a favourite, although I fear it's not possible.

Is any of these solutions feasible?

Plus, an incidental problem: I wanted to check in the server rules if there was a specific mention of Midway's carrier, but I cannot find them anymore. Have they moved?

Arkos

Sedmin

Reputation: +2783

Registered: 2014-06-06

Posts: 7,048

Re: Carrier sinking / respawning on Midway

...

You know, this problem is solved if someone takes care of the own carrier earlier in game.

If i can't get a plane at start i take care of the carrier.

...

Last edited by Arkos (2020-11-19 15:56:52)

Insane

Player

Reputation: +1126

Location: Kharkiv

Registered: 2016-07-07

Posts: 1,201

Re: Carrier sinking / respawning on Midway

Making an Anti-base-camp bubble around each side might help maybe? But I fear that it would make a funny graveyard of ghostships there. I wonder if there is any possibility to make them disappear...
Also noobs will drive straight into this bubble, destroying another ship. But if you make a spawn rate of ships really fast, it would solve this problem.

So can there be an ABC area bubble, plus fast spawn rate for ships?

Last edited by Insane (2020-11-20 11:56:15)

Notapix

Player

Reputation: +17

Registered: 2017-09-13

Posts: 27

Re: Carrier sinking / respawning on Midway

this problem is solved if someone takes care of the own carrier earlier in game.

Sure, it's a problem that arises only when one team lacks good players. But sometimes they join game too late, and it isn't fun for them.
IMHO it's always better when a game doesn’t suffer too much of a high proportion of noobs, even those who push it up to the point where they drive the carrier to a flag (hell, pray it's not one of the land ones!).
Hell, a slaughterhouse is not fun, even for the slaughtering team. And noobs need to get a chance to improve (What am I, if not a slightly improved noob? ).

making it harder to sink would be a favourite, although I fear it's not possible.

That is completely doable, yet many may not approve of that here.

Then if it's doable it would be worth thinking about it. Maybe a 50% increase in strength would be the right point between an unsinkable carrier (not fun, especially if it's used properly) and the fragile tin-can it currently is. It wouldn't make the situation too different if the carrier is attacked normally, but it would earn it time to try to move to another position, time for players to try to repair, escape, etc. Which should be sufficient to restart the game if it's stuck into everyone-sinking-the-carrier mode.

As for the anti-base-camp bubble, I wouldn’t want that. It's the sea, not land; ships can move. If it was in a remote corner of the map, why not, but here in the middle of it, nope, it would ruin naval battles I think.

SloMo

Player

Reputation: +4

Registered: 2017-10-31

Posts: 23

Re: Carrier sinking / respawning on Midway

Carrier abuse is subject to interpretation of "Disrupting Gameplay" (which is also not on the rules list
I was thinking it was an Ethics Question with no Solution too.
Gentleman's Rules Don't apply.
It will be Hunted Down and sunk then Spawn next to the waiting enemy Battle Ship.
Which lead me to think, would parking the Battle Ship there for Multiple Respawns of the Carrier constitute "Base Camping" ?

Side Question: If you Can't Taxi to the Planes, then why can you use the Planes to Taxi to Flags? A Smoking Rule would be nice.

Zody

москит

Reputation: +440

Location: Honolulu

Registered: 2012-03-04

Posts: 1,959

Re: Carrier sinking / respawning on Midway

Side Question: If you Can't Taxi to the Planes, then why can you use the Planes to Taxi to Flags? A Smoking Rule would be nice.

This person asks the right questions people! Looking forward to answers

msbd

Member

Reputation: +47

Registered: 2016-09-04

Posts: 115

Re: Carrier sinking / respawning on Midway

Nice input here.

Would be possible to decrease the spawn times of the other ships? Maybe depending on the number of flags controlled, if that's possible: the less flags you have, the fastest they respawn. I've got no flags, you sink  my carrier: blam, eat the whole armada respawning in seconds!

Cannot be altered with stock configurations. Not sure if it can be modded here.  In CoD, I made all things like that as an option.

Or to give the carrier a couple of different spawn points, so that if it's sunk once it respawns someplace else? You sink it in B4, it respawns in A1 so you can't just resink it.

Same answer as above.

Changing spawn times depending on flags controlled is possible but not originally supported by the game and I don't think simple has the necessary framework to make such a thing happen.

Giving different spawn points is easier to achieve. You can stick spawners to a rotational bundle that let's objects spawn anywhere on a defined circle. For example you could make a rotational bundle in the center of the map so that ships can spawn on random locations around the island with the same distance to the centre.

henk

Administrator

Reputation: +261

Registered: 2018-07-07

Posts: 324

Re: Carrier sinking / respawning on Midway

good idea, you could also make ellipses or lines
while maintaining orientation

Last edited by henk (2021-03-19 20:19:52)

Darcano

Member

Reputation: +272

Registered: 2018-01-16

Posts: 452

Re: Carrier sinking / respawning on Midway

I think it would be better to just have it floating like on Arkos server.

msbd

Member

Reputation: +47

Registered: 2016-09-04

Posts: 115

Re: Carrier sinking / respawning on Midway

I think it would be better to just have it floating like on Arkos server.

Then you might as well just spawn the planes in the air like in the modern battlefield games. You can also put planes in rotational bundles and add a spawn point to them using some trickery so you can directly spawn inside the planes.

I think the circle makes more sense than an ellipsis or a line though.

Darcano

Member

Reputation: +272

Registered: 2018-01-16

Posts: 452

Re: Carrier sinking / respawning on Midway

I think it would be better to just have it floating like on Arkos server.

Then you might as well just spawn the planes in the air like in the modern battlefield games. You can also put planes in rotational bundles and add a spawn point to them using some trickery so you can directly spawn inside the planes.

I think the circle makes more sense than an ellipsis or a line though.

With infinites planes? I don't think thats a good idea. The floating carrier would prevent the superspawnrape ™ that happens when the teams are stacked.

simon

est'own'ya

Reputation: +553

Registered: 2014-08-13

Posts: 987

Re: Carrier sinking / respawning on Midway

Anything can be camped in this game

msbd

Member

Reputation: +47

Registered: 2016-09-04

Posts: 115

Re: Carrier sinking / respawning on Midway

I doubt we will ever see statically floating PCOs such as a carrier on simple other than for stealing their spawngroups. Making planes spawnable though like the apc and distributing some of them randomly across the map at high altitude seems like something that tuia might accept.

They can't be "camped" if you put them high enough or make their rotational speed fast enough.

SloMo

Player

Reputation: +4

Registered: 2017-10-31

Posts: 23

Re: Carrier sinking / respawning on Midway

It really felt like Spawn Camping.
I took the Destroyer over to the Carrier spawn and camped there Bagging a couple Carriers, a Battleship and a few Destoyers, there were only a few players but still... I felt a bit Shamed to be doing it and quit the game to post this.
I didn't see a Spawn Camping rule, maybe we should get one and apply it here.

Last edited by SloMo (2021-03-22 17:18:59)

Dr.ZoidbergCLAW

Player

Reputation: +364

Registered: 2015-10-04

Posts: 474

Re: Carrier sinking / respawning on Midway

As many things in life ,it depends how other people handle it....
I, for instance don't go to the spawnlocation of the ships to engage targets.(that's for beginners)
If the ship hasn't moved ,I don't attack it...it's as s1mple as that....
It's called :try and keep it fun for all.....
(there's enough score oriented players that would do ANYTHING to get that score up,even if it has to ruin someone else's fun by for example,spawncamping)

Not my gamestyle.....not even on Wake Island

Last edited by Dr.ZoidbergCLAW (2021-03-30 14:29:18)