Suggestion about..

Sunndae · 2014-11-19 17:25:53

I just saw someone comment on the facebook page that he would rather love to see punkbuster back alive than the liga page.

I was thinking: why not?.

The game isnt for sale anymore. Only illegal downloads are offered. Hackers are becoming a increasing problem and game-breaker. I think it would not be impossible to implement PB in the origin version, just like the patch that so many players are using now to see the server list.
Beside that, punkbuster is already working for the clanplayers. This would also allow updates of punkbuster, the so important screenshot feature and for example a message system to be implemented as to where to download punkbuster before someone gets kicked. Think about it.

I think the only ones with the technical know-how and experience are on this forum. Hence my post here. Is it a stupid idea?

Last edited by Sunndae (2014-11-19 17:29:20)

Coco · 2014-11-19 17:34:23

I also think that's the best thing to do.

Last edited by Coco (2014-11-19 17:35:53)

Millerke · 2014-11-19 19:50:16

Good idea Sundy, the bad thing is the latest pb is still in "ancient age". I do not know when did the last version came out.

tuia · 2014-11-20 01:45:11

There are some problems with implementing PunkBuster, mainly BF1942 Origin players would have to update their BF1942 to v1.61 executable (with BF1942 GameSpy patch, for example). PunkBuster does not work with BF1942 Origin default installation. Besides that, BF1942 players using Linux cannot join PunkBuster servers, they would be kicked from, though few seem to use Linux. I do play BF1942 in Linux running from Wine and surprisingly get better performance than in Windows.
It's not a stupid idea, I believe it's possible. We have discussed this before but it never went through with concern of losing too many players moving to PunkBuster. A useful thing to know beforehand would be how many of server regular players have PunkBuster installed or at least know where to get it. I've noticed before that change to PunkBuster in other servers was not successful and they eventually switched back to turning it off. It was way before GameSpy shutdown.

Sunndae · 2014-11-20 10:09:06

I dont know how editable punkbuster is? If it is possible to edit it so that the main problems are solved and all it would require was install it, like the serverfix, it wouldnt cause too many problems.

If the above can be fixed, a strategy would have to be defined as to how to implement it. I can understand there are a lot of players too lazy to install punkbuster or to search for it when it is not necessary. But when the popular servers for example create a pact (they work together), all announce the coming change long before and all implement it at the same time, it would create a need for the players to update their game. Besides that, most of the remaining players werent too lazy to find a different way of joining servers, hence I guess they wont be too lazy to do this either.

If PB is editable enough, you might also want to slow down the kick interval and work on a solution for a player to receive a message on his screen (preferably in red, large size) as why and where to download punkuster before the initial kick. Again, it depends on the editability.

I do not know how effective the most actual punkbuster is against the new hacks. What would be most important to have is the ability for administrators to take in-game screenshots again of a player his actual screen. This would take away a lot of research time for admins, be much more effective than recent methods and add trust to players again.

LL22 · 2014-11-20 10:18:59

I think that it's a good idea but we shall have to proceed by steps :

1 - Contact most owners of servers to know if it's possible and if they're agree to add Punkbuster.

2 - If they're agree, someone will have to update Punkbuster (no update by Evenbalance since February 3, 2010 if my information is good).

3 - If Punkbuster is updated, each servers will have to contact all these players (PM database, information in chat, ...) a few months before setting that.

Battlefield 1942 has survived to the stop of support of gamespy, thanks to some lovers for this game.
So it's not a simple anti-cheat system which is going to kill BF1942, on the contrary !

Last edited by LL22 (2014-11-20 12:58:15)

tuia · 2014-11-20 12:41:55

Players can't even join a PunkBuster server, if they don't have PunkBuster installed and enabled. The slow down of kick interval would only be useful for players who have outdated PunkBuster version, if they installed some old PB version from original BF1942 CDs.
Servers enabling PunkBuster will require that players use BF1942 retail executable, which has some crash problems in Windows 7 and above opposite to BF1942 Origin executable, and install latest PunkBuster files. The switch to PunkBuster would be easier for us than for -=aX=-, MoonGamers and other v1.612 servers, since most players there use BF1942 Origin executable.
As far as I know, PunkBuster can't be easily updated, because it's closed and obfuscated code. You can configure it to do MD5 checks, searching for specific file hashes. But, I'm not sure how effective it is, right now, the main use of PunkBuster would be the possibilty to take remote screenshots.
I have automated PunkBuster installation in BF1942 setup, so that new players have PunkBuster already enabled, with the possibility in the future to run PunkBuster in the servers. But, this move has to be planned carefully.

Lin · 2014-11-20 14:59:32

We (MoonGamers) have recently talked about going back to the CD version just to have Punkbuster back. We know there would be a huge player base hit doing this. Punkbuster is old, out of date, and a pain in the ass for new players to install but we have worked them through installation before. The benefits: screenshots and kick reasons. To date, that decision has not been reached...primarily because of the player base hit.

We are so very tired of the hackers, you can count MoonGamers in for anything needed to bring some integrity back to the game.

Thank you to LL22 for sending me the link to this thread.

Millerke · 2014-11-20 15:46:47

Well, to be honest the "origin" version is useless. Since gamespy is down, there is nothing to check the cd keys.

So some easy steps and everybody will have cd version 1.61 bf1942.
E-bay buy / Download bf1942 anthology, install, patch, gamespy fix, pb install and that is all.

Last edited by Millerke (2014-11-20 15:47:12)

s[sk] · 2014-11-20 16:18:32

I could write a half page long post about what would happen, what would it do to the server and global bf1942 population that is dwindling day by day but i'll just sum it as "bad idea"
it would be like gamespy shutdown, just bigger and this time brought upon us by ourselves

Sunndae · 2014-11-20 17:11:20

I already guessed that its code would be too difficult. The main use of PB is the screenshot feature and the anti-hack work they implemented until they quit the support.

SSK would you mind writing your half page? . I'd be interested in reading your 'scenario'. I for one also thought the game wouldnt survive the gamespy shutdown, but it did. There are also possible strategies that will lead to a step - by step implementation.

Last edited by Sunndae (2014-11-20 17:14:05)

Sunndae · 2014-11-20 17:29:19

Hackers sure are also a reason for the decreasing population, they are spoiling the fun for the remaining. I notice an increase of activity?. A 'dont do anything' scenario might also lead to destruction. In the end it always does.

Punkbuster used to be able to permban people and they had to buy a new cdkey if they wanted to play again, something that now doesnt work anymore. This is something that should also be considered. PB would save time, but it wouldnt keep them away. It would only allow much more effective handling.

George · 2014-11-20 18:12:30

Or , maybe add a vanilla server with latest ancient PB on, and leave the current fra server as is, so , there would be no player drop, and us oldies would gladly play on pb one, because many many many kids wouldn't be able to join there, and we d have some fun as we used to have.

Sociopatico · 2014-11-20 19:49:26

Pb wasn't really effective even when it was updated, but I think it should be mandatory on the server.

Best anti-cheat software I ever experienced, in the past, was "DMW Client" on Mohaa (http://www.dmwworld.com/viewdownloads). Unfortunately it has never been adapted to Battlefield

seventy · 2014-11-20 20:40:14

Sociopatico wrote:

Best anti-cheat software I ever experienced, in the past, was "DMW Client" on Mohaa (http://www.dmwworld.com/viewdownloads). Unfortunately it has never been adapted to Battlefield

Best anti-cheat software is called "LL22".

George · 2014-11-20 20:44:13

Luke version 1.2 beta , but i think even www.69Sex0_haxor_catcher.com can do the magic

tuia · 2014-11-21 01:17:51

Well, you just have to inform players to install BF1942 GameSpy patch and latest PunkBuster. You don't need to change server to v1.61 to run PunkBuster.
I believe it's possible and BF.MAXNET.ua and EA 117 servers have proved it, they have a PunkBuster enabled server for Desert Combat mod using BF1942 server version 1.612 and it's populated. The switch to PunkBuster would be harder for -=aX=-, MoonGamers, Oz Wake and other BF1942 v1.612 servers, as I've wrote before, as most players would have to update their BF1942 executable, first, and every step is a barrier, no matter how easy it is.

HoOK · 2014-11-21 04:36:28

What about testing punkbuster ability in a server?
As a client, just download all available cheats on the internet and see how many of them will be detected by punkbuster.

Sunndae · 2014-11-21 07:54:40

Testing would be good, but dont download cheats man. Punkbuster wont catch the most actual hacks, but they will get caught with the built-in screenshot feature. The screenshot feature in PB allows to take a screenshot of someones in-game screen. Thats where you can see minimap and taghacks, no fog or recoil etc.

Shing · 2014-11-21 18:52:42

Why don't you test the population with punkbuster? Test for 1 week and see the results. Even if PB is outdated, its better than nothing and the screenshot feature is really useful.

tuia · 2014-11-21 23:32:33

There are some current limitations to PunkBuster in BF1942. Before implementing it, one should study it is effectiveness. I believe, remote screenshot does not work properly to players running BF1942 in Windows 8.

Millerke · 2014-11-22 15:58:37

tuia wrote:

There are some current limitations to PunkBuster in BF1942. Before implementing it, one should study it is effectiveness. I believe, remote screenshot does not work properly to players running BF1942 in Windows 8.

I know that, win7 also has the same prob like gives black screens randomly, but 80% it works if you make more than 1 screenshots about the player.

Sunndae · 2014-11-22 18:08:42

As long PBSS doesnt work for windows 8, I dont think there is much use for implementating it.

Coco · 2014-11-22 23:31:59

Millerke wrote:

80% it works if you make more than 1 screenshots about the player.

If you roll a dice twice, then the outcome in the first roll will not affect the probabilities of the outcomes when the dice is rolled a second time

But seriously, can you explain it to us in detail ?
80% is more than enough. Is it the same for Win8 ?

Since you seem to be reluctant applying it to all servers, maybe we should start with all RTR+SW servers ?

LL22 · 2014-11-24 12:39:24

Does someone know why EvenBalance hasn't supported anymore Punkbuster for BF1942 ?
This game lives again so why ? Is it purely commercial to promote the new games ?

Millerke · 2014-11-24 14:07:34

LL22 wrote:

Does someone know why EvenBalance hasn't supported anymore Punkbuster for BF1942 ?
This game lives again so why ? Is it purely commercial to promote the new games ?

no more money = no more support sadly

Millerke · 2014-11-24 14:10:24

Coco wrote:

Millerke wrote:
80% it works if you make more than 1 screenshots about the player.
If you roll a dice twice, then the outcome in the first roll will not affect the probabilities of the outcomes when the dice is rolled a second time
But seriously, can you explain it to us in detail ?
80% is more than enough. Is it the same for Win8 ?
Since you seem to be reluctant applying it to all servers, maybe we should start with all RTR+SW servers ?

Well when we tried to get more life to my old LS clan, we tried to make a new server under win8 but nobody want to pay for it so we stopped that project. As i remember i tried to make screenshots, configured to take screens from the minimaps (x,y coordinates) and most of them worked. Just had to make more than 1 screenshot.

Last edited by Millerke (2014-11-24 14:11:10)

DICE DA MAN · 2014-11-24 20:57:54

Why not try a modification pb if there are opportunities? If a modification to achieve just that pb of each client (regardless of the operating system of the client) can capture a screenshot, will be enough to quickly find hackers but it will not be a long-term solution, because hackers will again return to the game and continue to throw shit at the game. The general problem is in the CD key. As I already said to Tuia, and I will mention here, that would solve the annoying longer term hacker is necessary to establish a new base cd keys of the players in this way, such as by players call a certain cd key and its hash, their ownership and the best way to do this is to be made (if possible) simple automated online registration form is available to all users (regardless of whether they are registered or not simple ax forum) in which players will enter your prefered ingame nickname, email, cd key and its hash and from the moment of declaring ownership of that cd key the same will be valid CD key in the database after 15 days. Consider whether any hacker worth it for the sake of five minutes per game throwing shit to wait 15 days to obtain a valid cd key ... Long live the message "invalid cd key, cd key in use or cd key is globaly banned" ... After all, how many Tuia and ssk done for us ordinary players were not obliged to do so, I would not have anything against that they sell cd keys, I'd first bought it, it would at least be some monetary benefits from hackers and also make the effort Tuia and ssk which they did for us, paid off.

tuia · 2014-11-25 01:20:18

Modifying PunkBuster for BF1942 is difficult, even if only to support remote screenshots in Windows 8.
I've always found strange why Battlefield 1942 stopped having PunkBuster support and Battlefield Vietnam still continues to have. It was probably an end of contract decision.
That CD-key database is not a good idea, in my opinion, and it has technical problems.

DICE DA MAN · 2014-11-25 02:09:09

Here and now not so important, the reasons why there is no more Punkbuster support for BF1942. Whatever you decide, activating, modifying PunkBuster or not, you will realize that it is actually checks cd key thing that will dispel hackers.

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