Market Garden balance

Shing · 2014-12-13 12:25:10

In my opinion, this map is way too hard for Axis. This is what happens most of the time:
The half team is raped at the beginning by planes on the bridge. Then it keeps getting worse. Axis has to wait for the next APC/tank spawns and at the same time Allied is ready with their tanks and mine field on the bridge. Game over.
Even if Axis goes through the defense its very hard to capture the bases, because they are capturable from a lot of very good and hidden places (inside buildings, behind buildings, etc). So the flag remains neutral. This is the case already at the bridges. So the team is stuck.

Suggestion:
Reduce planes on both sides to avoid the winning situation at the beginning. Planes are not much help for Axis, if the team is stuck on both bridges. For Allied its much more important, i already mentioned why.

Flettnerman · 2014-12-13 12:42:43

This map is originally unbalanced, no way to balance it.

Shing · 2014-12-13 17:13:11

Well, you are right. xd But there is a lot of way to help on it.

HoOK · 2014-12-13 20:14:19

increase spawn time for planes?

Kobra · 2014-12-14 16:21:33

Give axis a Parachute spawn?

Millerke · 2014-12-15 00:18:43

Well.
What if the allies get plane, but only after they took/lose a flag?

tuia · 2014-12-15 00:32:23

I will change map tomorrow based on your input and you decide if it is better.

Sociopatico · 2014-12-15 13:22:24

I suggest to give Axis the possibility of parachuting from a spawn plane (instead of APC) and resize capturing flag bubbles

Last edited by Sociopatico (2014-12-15 13:23:19)

nämeless · 2014-12-15 13:41:17

Stop this weird modding, please!

ziba128 · 2014-12-15 14:15:22

I think removing allied APC with spawn will be enough

Sociopatico · 2014-12-15 14:25:10

nämeless wrote:

Stop this weird modding, please!

what about some flettners and boats?

Millerke · 2014-12-15 14:33:07

"Atompanzer" Soci pep

Coco · 2014-12-15 14:39:35

When there's no efficient pilote on Allied side, which is more often than not, this map can be a nightmare. Axe's tankers gather paratroopers without even breaking a sweat.

If you reduce planes, please reduce tanks.

Millerke · 2014-12-15 15:01:08

If i remember correctly, in the earlier versions of Market Garden (like in v 1.20 or sthg like that) there were some landing crafts on axis side, so they could use it to get across.

valento · 2014-12-15 16:23:37

Millerke wrote:

If i remember correctly, in the earlier versions of Market Garden (like in v 1.20 or sthg like that) there were some landing crafts on axis side, so they could use it to get across.

to easy target for stangs

Flettnerman · 2014-12-15 16:31:36

Sociopatico wrote:

nämeless wrote:
Stop this weird modding, please!
what about some flettners and boats?

That would be intresting, but nobody will play vs me on this map and tuia would set the bots on vanilla server.

Millerke · 2014-12-15 16:49:43

valento wrote:

Millerke wrote:
If i remember correctly, in the earlier versions of Market Garden (like in v 1.20 or sthg like that) there were some landing crafts on axis side, so they could use it to get across.
to easy target for stangs

ah! mustangs. well, at least more routes, than 2 bridges.

Last edited by Millerke (2014-12-15 16:50:22)

Kobra · 2014-12-15 19:17:41

Coco wrote:

When there's no efficient pilote on Allied side, which is more often than not, this map can be a nightmare. Axe's tankers gather paratroopers without even breaking a sweat.
If you reduce planes, please reduce tanks.

that was my second thought, putting market in a more infantry based aspect.

make sure that the parachute spawn doesn't make it possible to land on some roofs!

Timmos · 2014-12-15 23:44:07

Just place a katuysha with a fucking nuke on it to assrape the city

Shing · 2016-08-15 16:57:44

It's just me or this map is still horribly balanced? Axis needs a perfect team to capture all the bases and hold them. And that's the only way to win as Axis, because they are starting with less score. And even if they hold everything, allied team is able to spawn near at church and at their main base, which is totally fine. I'm just saying they are able to counterarrack. BUT if axis is bad (or not even bad, just an average team), then they are pretty much fu**d, because they need to go through the bridges, so they are stuck at main base.

Even if Axis has better air team there are the mine fields and anti-tank players at the bridge. Even if they are able to capture few bases, allied is able to spread easily and make the bases at least neutral, so they don't even need to do much, they are able to win, again because they are starting with more tickets. The little ships aren't really helping, because it's easy to spot them and the max amount for a ship is 2 players and you can't really do much with that. You make a base neutral for 30 seconds, then you die. That's why i'm saying Axis needs a perfect team, it's possible to win, but everyone needs to work together to defend every little place. But this isn't a realistic scenario on a server like this.

Is this only my experience? Is there a way to know the ratios of winning? In my experience allied is almost always winning.

Last edited by Shing (2016-08-15 16:58:03)

Arkos · 2016-08-15 17:47:43

...

If Axis hold the church, at least white, they can win. But people, 2/3 of the Team must spawn at flags and specially church and attack from there. If the Teamwork is good and all report upcoming enemys it's only a matter of time, before the other 3 flags are captured too.

Between the other 1/3 or 1/4 spawn in base for Tanks and planes. But specially this map can only be won as axis, if you take and hold the 4 flags.

We won many times as axis but it's only possible if all are playing as a team.

...

Sepp · 2016-12-06 00:48:46

Not only is this map hideously unbalanced, it's historically a load of bullshit. There were no Americans at this battle, it was British paratroops. And Axis had the advantage not Allies. I would remove the map completely as 9 out of 10 times it's a guaranteed Allied win from the start when the two bridges become choke points. Allied planes? Not only do they get fighters they get a bomber.

Tedje · 2016-12-06 12:25:28

We need PanzerSchokolade ..!

tuia · 2016-12-09 14:10:24

Sepp wrote:

Not only is this map hideously unbalanced, it's historically a load of bullshit. There were no Americans at this battle, it was British paratroops. And Axis had the advantage not Allies. I would remove the map completely as 9 out of 10 times it's a guaranteed Allied win from the start when the two bridges become choke points. Allied planes? Not only do they get fighters they get a bomber.

Sepp, ours Market Garden map is modded with Axis having a few airplanes and some extra vehicles. I do agree, historically, it is a huge mistake (how could EA devs miss that?!), but it is not possible to change from American to British soldiers with a server-side mod.

noice · 2016-12-10 18:15:24

Don`t forget to put submarine on a river.

And maybe some chi-ha tanks on stalingrad map

Sepp · 2016-12-15 00:41:27

It's not a good map or a good theme. It could be made better by having all the Allied armor spawn points on their airfield at the back. Removing air power (if I'm correct historically, Allied air power could not help the paras at Arnhem due to bad weather). This way the Axis would always get across the bridge and the paras would have to hold the area until Allied armor turned up, thus making the map at least a bit more historically accurate, while still giving the Allies a chance to beat Axis back over the bridge. I think this would produce a far more interesting scenario.

bloody[CHN] · 2017-01-30 05:34:24

Market Garden
Axis:bridge and allied plane

Ëlf · 2017-01-30 07:04:57

I recommend swapping the stangs for spits to even out the air fight

{Phantom} · 2017-01-30 15:47:07

All of the bad players throughout the 14 years have always wanted a balanced game. Something these players do not understand is that sometimes it is funner when games are unbalanced, it makes winning much more delightful when odds are stacked against you. Also, this map would be very easy to put up a fight as the Axis if people would actually use the boats tuia has given us to quickly get across to one of the bridge flags and being able to easily neutralize it. Unfortunately, sucky players tend to not think outside the box and would just rather have the game change and be easier for them.

Arkos · 2017-01-30 16:28:42

...

... and we will discuss it 2 years again

...

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#1 2014-12-13 12:25:10

Market Garden balance

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Re: Market Garden balance

#3 2014-12-13 17:13:11

Re: Market Garden balance

#4 2014-12-13 20:14:19

Re: Market Garden balance

#5 2014-12-14 16:21:33

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#6 2014-12-15 00:18:43

Re: Market Garden balance

#7 2014-12-15 00:32:23

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#8 2014-12-15 13:22:24

Re: Market Garden balance

#9 2014-12-15 13:41:17

Re: Market Garden balance

#10 2014-12-15 14:15:22

Re: Market Garden balance

#11 2014-12-15 14:25:10

Re: Market Garden balance

#12 2014-12-15 14:33:07

Re: Market Garden balance

#13 2014-12-15 14:39:35

Re: Market Garden balance

#14 2014-12-15 15:01:08

Re: Market Garden balance

#15 2014-12-15 16:23:37

Re: Market Garden balance

#16 2014-12-15 16:31:36

Re: Market Garden balance

#17 2014-12-15 16:49:43

Re: Market Garden balance

#18 2014-12-15 19:17:41

Re: Market Garden balance

#19 2014-12-15 23:44:07

Re: Market Garden balance

#20 2016-08-15 16:57:44

Re: Market Garden balance

#21 2016-08-15 17:47:43

Re: Market Garden balance

#22 2016-12-06 00:48:46

Re: Market Garden balance

#23 2016-12-06 12:25:28

Re: Market Garden balance

#24 2016-12-09 14:10:24

Re: Market Garden balance

#25 2016-12-10 18:15:24

Re: Market Garden balance

#26 2016-12-15 00:41:27

Re: Market Garden balance

#27 2017-01-30 05:34:24

Re: Market Garden balance

#28 2017-01-30 07:04:57

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